New Zealand Herald Debate on Tibet/China conflict

Nick (Auckland)
A group of prominent Chinese intellectuals recently called on their government to begin talks with the Dalai Lama and allow UN investigators into Tibet. In an open letter, a group of 30 writers, university professors and rights activists urged the Communist Party to hold direct dialogue with the Dalai Lama. It seems there are different view points on the Tibetan conflict even within the Chinese community. My understanding is that the Dalai Lama does not want independence but rather "a meaningful degree of autonomy under Chinese rule". This would allow the Tibetan people the freedom to practice ideological/cultural forms that differ from Chinese Communism without the fear of persecution. Currently the cultural values of the Tibetan people are being systematically erased by the Chinese government. I acknowledge that Western countries are also guilty of trampling on human rights, and N.Z. Pakeha have a chequered history in relation to the Maori. Do Chinese people think China could benefit from dialogue with the Tibetan people like New Zealand has benefited from dialogue with the Maori through the Treaty of Waitangi?

Wayne Lo (Hong Kong)
Nick (Auckland): you say "cultural values of the Tibetan people are being systematically erased by the Chinese government." This is wrong. If the Chinese wished to 'systematically' erase Tibetan culture, they would have done this when China was completely shut off from the outside world during the first 30 years of the PRC, when the government was openly anti-religion, anti-old traditions - of all of China's ethnic groups, including the majority Han. Just think. About 2million Tibetans in 1950, 450million Chinese. If there was ever any intention at cultural or physical genocide, the Tibetans would have disappeared as quickly as the Tasmanian aborigines.Yet in the first 60 years of 'colonial' Chinese rule, Tibetan population,life expectancy has doubled. Compare this with the situation in NZ between 1840 and 1900. Maori population declined from 200,000 to 50,000 (6% of population). Tibetans are still 90% of Tibet. But yes, Tibetan traditions are being eroded-but not by the Chinese. Instead by a process called 'modernization.' In respect of this I refer you to the wonderfully nuanced posts of one Mark Anthony Jones.http:/www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/04/01/separatism-and-tibet/

Nick (Auckland)
Wayne Lo (Hong Kong): You make some valid points about the negative impact of colonial rule on indigenous cultures. However, I think it is wrong to site Maori population decline from 1840-1900 as a comparative moral victory for China's conduct in Tibet. There were mitigating factors in Maori population decline during that period such as the use of the musket in inter-tribal warfare and European diseases. I suggest ethical standards are a more exacting measure of our countries different colonial attitudes. Maori are not tortured for exercising freedom of speech, waving the Maori flag, or voicing support for Tino Rangatiratanga (Maori sovereignty). I am grateful that we have a forum here for open debate. Maori also have a high percentage of representation in New Zealand parliament. What percentage of representation do Tibetan people have in Chinese politics? I question the figures you present on Chinese population transfer. "Tibetans are still 90% of Tibet." This from the Tibetan government in exile website. "In Tibet today there are over 7.5 million non-Tibetan settlers including Chinese and Hui Muslims while Tibetans inside Tibet comprise only six million. The increasing Chinese population transfer into Tibet has reduced the Tibetan people to a minority group in their own land.”
Your earlier comments have prompted me to further research the Tibetan issue from a Chinese perspective, and the historical context which gave rise to the Peoples Republic. The gross exploitation of the Chinese at the hands of imperialist powers during the Opium Wars, and invasions by multiple foreign powers until WWII places the preceding hard-line PRC policies in a more understandable context. But this does not make totalitarianism any less frightening. I am glad that the Chinese modernization of Tibet has aided in the dissemination of the profound wisdom of Tibetan Buddhism to a world that is currently destroying itself. This Tibetan conflict is symptomatic of a much larger problem that all of humanity is embroiled in. How can we live together on this earth without destroying each other and the planet?

Wayne Lo (Hong Kong)
Nick of Auckland: I appreciate your efforts to appreciate the Chinese perspective.My figures are for the Tibetan Autonomous Region. Tibetan exile groups are hardly a non-biased source, but in any case their figures, are I believe for all of what they consider to be the historical Tibet - not just the TAR. But thanks - I will look more into this.I take your point about the differences in circumstance between Maoris and Tibetans, which caused the decline (initially) of the former, although my main point stands. There was never any attempt at genocide against the Tibetans, contrariwise the Chinese govt has improved the lives of Tibetans in countless objective ways.It is true that there is less freedom of speech in China than in NZ. But you imply that Tibetans are singled out for particularly rough treatment. This is untrue. The human rights problems, real or perceived, are no more, no less than for all other Chinese. Even during the Cultural Revolution, there was no campaign against Tibetans. There was a campaign against all Chinese culture of all nationalities. In fact most of the damage to Tibetan cultural relics at the time was by Tibetan Red Guards - the sons of former serfs.